WPAN as innovation?

Allin Kahrl qbject at gmail.com
Fri Apr 15 16:11:43 EDT 2011


Many thanks!

On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 10:01 AM, jon at rejon.org <jon at rejon.org> wrote:
> Cool, added! http://en.qi-hardware.com/wiki/Ben_WPAN
>
> On Fri, Apr 15, 2011 at 10:29 AM, Allin Kahrl <qbject at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Jon-
>> Thanks much for adding all that. I hadn't really tuned in to Ben-WPAN
>> until recently, and now I feel like I understand why it's so exciting
>> (especially knowing how asymmetric Werner's workshop is against
>> conventional commercial R&D environments).
>>
>> I have one request: Is there a citation we can add to the "dark ages"
>> statement at
>> http://en.qi-hardware.com/wiki/Ben_WPAN#Is_freedom_really_innovation?_As_in_we_have_the_freedom_to_make_our_own_WPAN?
>> This sounds like an essential bit of history to inform our collective
>> enthusiasm for open development, but I know nothing about it.
>>
>> Thanks again.
>> [allin]
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 11:51 PM, jon at rejon.org <jon at rejon.org> wrote:
>> > Ok, this is all super cool. I consolidated your guys answers here:
>> >
>> > http://en.qi-hardware.com/wiki/Ben_WPAN
>> >
>> > If you guys have more to add, there are some sections that would be good
>> > to
>> > get more notes like progress and outcomes. Even just those links to the
>> > mailing list are useful. I needed somewhere to point people.
>> >
>> > I've been talking to a bunch of people about WPAN and the innovative
>> > parts
>> > of copyleft hardware. So, I might have some questions which I hope
>> > provide
>> > another dimension to what we are working on, and will do my best to
>> > integrate onto the wiki.
>> >
>> > I'm trying to think more about why someone in the real world (consumers,
>> > investors, technologists, etc) would be interested in our tech.
>> >
>> > My life post-meeting-Wolfgang, I now refrain from noting speculative
>> > conversations I have but just not that my silence is not indicative of
>> > inactivity, but mostly refrain from getting people's hopes up ;) and
>> > making
>> > myself sound more vaporous than I am ;)
>> >
>> > On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 12:25 PM, Werner Almesberger
>> > <werner at almesberger.net> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> I wrote:
>> >> > With my ATBEN/ATUSB prototypes, I've obtained good to acceptable BER
>> >> > for a distance between stations of 4-7 m indoors in a residential
>> >> > area with relatively few interferences.
>> >>
>> >> A clarification on the error rate (BER = Bit Error Rate, PER = Packet
>> >> Error Rate):
>> >>
>> >> IEEE 802.15.4 defines a maximum PER of 1% for a PSDU of 20 bytes.
>> >> This means that all bits of the PSDU, the length (1 byte) and the SFD
>> >> (1 byte) be received without errors, and that enough bits of the
>> >> preamble (4 bytes) must be received for the receiver to synchronize.
>> >> To keep the numbers simple, let's assume that's 200 bytes in total.
>> >> Thus
>> >>
>> >> 1-PER = 1-(1-BER)^200
>> >>
>> >> With PER = 1%, we get a BER of about 50 ppm.
>> >>
>> >> Since our primary usage scenario, Internet access, would often use
>> >> maximum-sized packets, I used max-sized packets for my measurements as
>> >> well. The maximum PSDU size is 127 bytes. So we get 200+8*(127-20) =
>> >> 1056 bits.
>> >>
>> >> Aiming for a PER of 1% with full-sized packets, the BER has to be
>> >> lower, about 9.5 ppm.
>> >>
>> >> - Werner
>> >
>> > I learn a lot from you guys! So great! I'm excited by this
>> > project...super
>> > excited!
>> >
>> > My friends Sean Bonner, Joi Ito and Bunnie Huang are working on this
>> > pop-up
>> > project http://rdtn.org to make radiation sensors. I'm actually supposed
>> > to
>> > be in Tokyo right now working with them on some other projects, but the
>> > tsunami/earthquake happened, and they got into this website and making
>> > radiation sensors.
>> >
>> > http://blog.seanbonner.com/2011/04/11/what-im-working-on-rdtn/
>> >
>> > Well, you can imagine that I pitched them hard on copyleft hardware, but
>> > I
>> > was too late and now Bunnie and some other tech companies are working on
>> > this *product.*
>> >
>> > However, that is not the point, but rather, I think the sensor networks
>> > are
>> > super important for the future of our civilization.
>> >
>> > Part of what makes the Internet successful is that it allows for humans
>> > to
>> > stay spread out more, so we don't annihilate each other. And, the
>> > success
>> > rate for our species increases with increase of disasters, wars,
>> > disease,
>> > etc, as the population increases in size.
>> >
>> > Well, sensors are part of this mix IMO. So, I look forward to seeing how
>> > we
>> > can work on both sensors (getting info), sending that info
>> > (internet/network/WPAN), and using that info (people/us!).
>> >
>> > The Internet are the wires, but we need to extend our bodies/information
>> > gathering apparatuses and our senses, hence sensors are important for
>> > survival of our species. And, a great place for us to occupy as copyleft
>> > hardware.
>> >
>> > Bravo Werner!
>> >
>> > A sidenote, where should the Ben WPAN enhanced page go on the wiki? I
>> > think
>> > we should have a stack of our core technologies on the main page.
>> >
>> > What else are we doing that is innovative and in that technology stack
>> > (and
>> > not talking products!)?
>> >
>> > Jon
>> >
>> > --
>> > Jon Phillips
>> > http://rejon.org/ | http://fabricatorz.com/
>> > chat/skype: kidproto | irc: rejon
>> > +1.415.830.3884 (global) | +1-510-499-0894 (sf)
>> > +86-187-1003-9974 (beijing)
>> >
>> >
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>
>
> --
> Jon Phillips
> http://rejon.org/ | http://fabricatorz.com/
> chat/skype: kidproto | irc: rejon
> +1.415.830.3884 (global) | +1-510-499-0894 (sf)
> +86-187-1003-9974 (beijing)
>
>




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